23. January 7, 2024
5 Questions: S. Leo Chiang, the director of newly Oscar-shortlisted doc short ISLAND IN BETWEEN has some answers
In my last post, I wrote about ISLAND IN BETWEEN which has since been shortlisted for the Oscar! It’s a hugely exciting development for any filmmaker, but for one as accomplished and vital to the community of documentary filmmakers as S. Leo Chiang, who is telling an incredibly timely and high stakes, geopolitical story about the future of Taiwan from a grounded, personal perspective, it’s especially meaningful. As someone who’s also lived in the U.S., Taiwan and China, as a documentary filmmaker examining the relationships between these countries, and as a friend of Leo’s who is deeply inspired by his work and eager to collaborate with him in the future, I was so happy when Ted agreed we could co-host one of his “5 Questions” for filmmakers Substack posts for ISLAND IN BETWEEN and Leo.
It’s not easy opening up in these interviews. Not only does Leo share personal insights and excellent advice, but, like Ted, he has ideas about how to improve our sense of community among filmmakers, particularly in documentary, and how to improve the business of documentary filmmaking for all. Be sure to save twenty minutes to watch ISLAND IN BETWEEN available at the end of this post.
In dealing with real life subjects -- be they people, places, things or ideas -- beyond just putting the camera on them, how do you ensure you are giving them the dignity, humanity, compassion that all of us are deserving of?
A couple of films into my career, I realized that I only wanted to make films about people and places I adored. I would not be that hard-hitting investigative filmmaker, and I embraced this limitation to be the core of who I am as a documentarian. In my interactions with my subjects--either in-person and especially in the editing room working with their footage—I do constantly ask myself, “am I objectifying them by holding this one shot for such a long time?” And, “Do I fetishize them by focusing on this particular detail?” Usually I do pretty good here, because I tend to build long-term, trusting relationships with my subjects (people, things, places or ideas) that last beyond the completion of the film.
One aspect that I do need to be mindful of in my process is becoming overly accommodating to my subjects. I don’t want my fondness for them to hold me back from examining their shortcomings and challenging them in their beliefs. The best way to honor my subjects, I believe, is to present them as full complex human beings and ideas. Coddling and defending them unconditionally will only result in one-dimensional, inauthentic, patronizing portraitures. With my films, and my relationships with my subjects, I strive to celebrate the messy beauty of life, and amplify the little moments of humanity as I encounter them.
What makes something great? In cinema and/or in life? What are the qualities you look for and try to bring into your life and process?
Whenever something exceeds my expectations, I usually think it’s pretty great. The moment I realize that I’ve done something to level up a personal or a work relationship always seems pretty great. The feeling that someone listening to my story understands exactly what I’m trying to get across… that’s pretty great. Checking to-dos off a list feels great. The few anticipatory seconds of black screen between the end of previews and the opening credits in a movie theater are totally great. Whenever possible, I celebrate actions and ideas that deepen my connections with the people I love and the work I care about.
What are some practical things we might be able to do to improve things in the industry?
Three things I’ve been thinking about on the documentary side--
One - Let’s work to develop more committed career producers. Specifically, there are a handful of successful doc producers working on higher budget projects, but there is not a business model to sustain producers who work on beautiful cinematic projects that may not have clear “commercial” appeal. We can set up fellowships that pay for producers’ salaries for a couple of years. In exchange, they commit to shepherding ten documentary projects to completion as an indirect grant support for the projects. In the independent documentary field, where many directors have access to stories but not the business know-how to move their projects forward, great producers can be the perfect boosters. Pushing the doc field to be more producer-centric can also reduce costs by consolidating production infrastructures (so each director does not have to deal with their own insurance and bookkeeping etc.)
Two – The documentary community in the US has not been handling conflicts within the field very well in the last few years. We need to come to a new agreement on how we can engage each other around disagreements and critiques. We need ways to communicate based on kindness and respect, and give benefit of the doubt to the individual, the entity, or the work that we are critiquing. All of us have worked hard to build this community, and we should continue to celebrate diverse opinions in ways that unify and stimulate—instead of divide--the community.
Three - As a filmmaker working in both the US and Asia, I see a strong need for the doc field to invest in language access. The prerequisite of English fluency for participation of filmmakers from non-English speaking parts of the world is frustrating. We need translation help at pitching forums and markets, and to translate proposals so the creative teams have the option of expressing themselves in their native languages.
What's been one of the skills that you had to develop in your filmmaking process, that's been difficult to master, but elevated your work? What were the barriers to mastering it and how did it elevate things?
I am a pretty cautious person. I have this theory that we Taiwanese are a cautious people. For so long, Taiwan lives under constant military threat from China. And since the Taiwanese people cannot control the fate of our country, we overcompensate by being extremely risk-averse in our personal lives. Because I don’t want things to go wrong, I over plan. I know I am generalizing the traits of an entire population here, but I do know that my fear of making mistakes meant that I do not always make adventurous creative attempts.
Happily, I do think I am improving on this front, mostly due to age and experience. Having made five independent feature docs and numerous other projects of varying scopes, I see that the sky does not fall if I make a mistake, that happy accidents do happen, and improvisations lead to surprising revelations often for the better. I think my new Oscar-shortlisted doc ISLAND IN BETWEEN demonstrates a freer, more spontaneous style compared to my earlier films because of my continuing work to, well, loosen up a bit more as a filmmaker.
When I consider embarking on getting a film made, one of my first questions is “Why this film now?”. So: why this film now? -- be it your most recent, or any or all of your films?
Yes! Most filmmakers I know are always asking ourselves and each other “why this film now?” But as we launch ISLAND IN BETWEEN, I’m not getting asked this question for the first time in a long time. This film is a personal exploration of the Taiwan Strait conflict. The escalating tension between Taiwan and China is now front of mind for many around the world. It’s certainly the case for the audiences in the US and East Asia, where the involvements of their governments in this conflict are examined and discussed constantly. For the audiences elsewhere, there are often comparisons to the situation in Ukraine. “It’s timely,” folks say to me. Funny enough, my primary motivation to make this film now wasn’t the timeliness of the subject matter. I’ve been thinking about a film that addresses the US-Taiwan-China relationship for a while, but had not been successful in finding an approach that resonated with me… until COVID kept me stationary in Taipei for over a year, and this prolonged stay altered my relationship with my homeland—forcing me to reconnect with this place meaningfully after I had lived away for decades. These rekindled sparks in my bond to Taiwan, including a fresh examination of my Taiwanese and American identities, ultimately pushed me to get this film done now.
Watch ISLAND IN BETWEEN here:
S. Leo Chiang is a filmmaker based in Taipei. His recent feature documentary, OUR TIME MACHINE, was nominated for an Emmy and a Gotham Award. In 2020, he directed two episodes of the Peabody-winning 5-part PBS series, ASIAN AMERICANS. His previous films include the Emmy Award-nominated A VILLAGE CALLED VERSAILLES, OUT RUN, MR. CAO GOES TO WASHINGTON, and TO YOU SWEETHEART, ALOHA. Leo’s work has received support from the Sundance Documentary Fund, Creative Capital, the Tribeca Film Institute, and ITVS. He has been a Sundance-Time Warner Fellow, a Rockwood JustFilms Fellow, and a Co-Chair of New Day Films. He has served as a mentor/trainer for the Hot Docs CrossCurrent Fellowship, the CNEX Chinese Documentary Forum, and AIDC (Australia). He is the co-founder of A-Doc, the Asian American Documentary Network, and a documentary branch member of the Academy of Motion Pictures and Sciences.
History is made! The first shared post from the Double Hope team! Woohoo!!!
Love love love Leo’s work and leadership in our field. The film is beautiful. Congratulations to all.